Western Baul Podcast Series

Languaging Nonduality (Rob Schmidt and Stuart Goodnick)

Grounded practice gives us direct experience of the pervasiveness of the mechanical, identified mind. Before we have direct experience of something, linguistic representations are ineffective at transmitting what it is. There is a distinction between results and practice. A teaching can be the result of practice, such as loving our neighbor, but we may consider it as a practice that we are unable to embody without having cultivated the necessary quality of being. Seeing the world as nondual is a result, not a practice. When nonduality is taken as an intellectual proposition, mind pastes over experience and co-opts the spiritual process, which is not realization. There are poets like Ursula Le Guin who use language to “point at the moon” or the sacred. There has to be some work with mind for the intuition and depth of nonduality to take root and inform all aspects of our lives. We may not be in a new paradigm of spiritual practice, but we are in a new paradigm of access to information and teachings. Nonduality is one way among others to talk about reality. Different spiritual approaches work for different people. For many, something has to be dislodged from its static position around the heart. There’s truth to being nondual and to being dual, which is paradoxical and indicative of a greater mystery. We can be grateful for language that brings our attention to something bigger than the small self. It’s not words but the carrier wave, where someone is coming from, that transmits what words point to. It’s helpful to hang out with people who share spiritual intention. Everyone doesn’t need to be involved in formal spiritual practice; lives are equally valid. Rob Schmidt and Stuart Goodnick run Tayu Meditation Center and founded Many Rivers Books and Tea in Sebastopol, CA. They invite spiritual teachers, practitioners, and authors to articulate their stories on The Mystical Positivist podcast.

What Can My Secret Life Offer Me on the Path? (David Herz)

Our private life involves a flow between ourselves and others, and we may choose to share details of it with those we trust will receive it with empathy, responsiveness and understanding. Our secret life, on the other hand, is known only to ourselves. It would be hard to share with others except in a rather touching and intimate way. It's deeply personal and mysterious, unique to our individual being. A secret life can be compared to dark matter, which is not understood but which may be considered as the nothingness from which everything known emerges. We have created the world we perceive by limiting how much we perceive and defining how we perceive it. But the secret life is always behind this. It can open us up to a place where we want to be, where we find refuge and guidance. Poets have a natural intuition of the secret life. They need it to be in touch with what they feel called upon to do. This way of looking at a secret life is distinct from other perspectives we may have about what a secret life is. Different interpretations of a secret life are explored, including one in which addictive habits and shame are hidden. On the spiritual path, we may self-observe a shadow of compulsions and obsessions that can affect our work when they control us, which wait to be addressed. There is also the way some keep their practice secret by not talking about it as a way of protecting their work. In the spiritual process, some may address their need for help by appealing for it in an inner way and may not want to speak about it. But we may also feel a need for intimacy, to share more of our private and secret lives with others with discrimination. Vulnerability to the Divine is a state worth working for. David Herz is a spiritual practitioner who lives in Paris where he has been a journalist, technical writer, communications officer, and an English instructor at universities.

My Interviews with Sisyphus (Tom Lennon)

The mythic image of Sisyphus, of a muscular man pushing a rock up a hill for eternity, represents something that needs to be known in us. We can consider it in various ways. For some, it’s about punishment by the gods for immoral behavior. For others, it’s a metaphor for an unfulfilling, demanding life. Or it can be a jumping off point from which to ask the larger questions of life. We can be taken by these characterizations, yet the Sisyphus image can open us to some other possibility. This talk is about inner world conversations, or interviews, that the speaker had with Sisyphus based on questions evoked over years by the image. How does Sisyphus endure his fate? What motivates him? What rock am I pushing up a hill? Do I have to struggle like I do? Who am I? What am I doing here? The Sisyphus story and Camus’ writing about it can only offer so much insight into the human condition as we are willing to explore for ourselves. We generally seek to be relieved of a burden we don’t want to feel. To go beyond that and resolve our own personal story requires an inner necessity that won’t leave us alone, a courageous intention to look into our own lives as opposed to looking to others for answers. It is lawful that help is available when we have a real need. Perhaps eternity does not exist and there is only doing what needs to be done in the present, here and now. We are binary beings who see life in terms of good and bad due to our thinking. We can’t open to an unknown quality of life beyond myth, to the path beyond self, by thinking. Feeling something “off the page” that is beyond thinking allows words to be used in a more refined context. Spiritual icons can be portals into another reality that can teach us. Tom Lennon, Ph.D., is a retired cultural resource consultant. He leads groups with the intention of supporting the spiritual process in others.

Seeing the Bigger Picture (Elise Erro/e.e.)

The reason we have questions is that we don’t see the bigger picture. As children, we don’t recognize the trauma we experience, but as we get older the sense that something is not right in life may lead us to the spiritual path. What happened to us informs how we respond to life in the present, but we live out of the programming of the past. As long as we’re reacting from childish programming that was designed to protect us then we’re unable to accept what is in the present. Self-observation and writing are ways to practically work with our thoughts, emotions, and patterns. When we have reactivity, we can come back to the body, be as present as possible, and be kind to ourselves. We can learn to be with what is going on for us instead of thinking that we should not feel the way we do. Homeostasis is when the body brings itself back into a stable and balanced state. Our habitual reactions keep the world intact and keep us identified with the person we believe ourselves to be. Loosening the intensity of our reactions makes it possible for us to see who we are underneath that. There is always more, always a bigger picture. We don’t fear the unknown; we fear the known ending. The prison we find ourselves in is the known. We may say we want to get beyond our known reactions, but it can be scary and our inner work will bring up resistance. Who are we if we don’t have our stories about ourselves? We can see how affirming, denying, and reconciling forces operate in our lives. There is benefit to working with people in a group who can remind us of our practice. We can hold to and nurture the experience that we sometimes have of who we are beyond our reactivity and definition of ourselves based in the past. Elise Erro (e.e.) has been committed to a life of engaging spiritual principles and service through theater, support for the dying, and bringing enjoyment to others as a chocolatier.

Conscious Surrender: Deepening Our Role in the Spiritual Process and Why It Matters (Vijaya Fedorschak)

The aim of all religions is to point out the path that leads to freedom, peace, and joy, which can only be realized through the surrender of ego. The principle of ego or separation permeates our lives. To realize oneness with God or the universe is to be conscious of the divine presence everywhere. Intellectual understanding is different than actual spiritual experience. Ego avoids surrender at all costs; yet the universe brings about transformation. In an absolute sense, surrender is already the case since the universe is what it is and couldn’t be otherwise here and now. When we are not flexible enough to move as the universe is moving, we cannot live in freedom, peace, and joy. But we can practice with conscious surrender and come to accept what is even when it is not our preference. Surrender is the intelligent way to relate to life since the universe rolls along without our agreement. Despite our apparent insignificance, we may lighten the burden of the Divine when we consciously accept what is. Everyday circumstances that we can surrender to and more challenging situations are considered. Surrendering to circumstance is different than surrendering to all of life. There is no proof of surrender other than the abiding experience, which requires self-honesty and has been the experience of different masters in all the traditions. Usually, we do not surrender to joy but tend to hold it in and try to contain it. Surrendering to others loosens the assemblage point, the way ego functions. Surrendering to our life purpose could be very ordinary or not. Surrender is surrender to self, but it is not so easy to distinguish between self and ego. Learning to surrender isn’t part of our education, but we can learn to follow what feels right and accept what is and act. VJ Fedorschak is the organizer of the Western Baul Podcast Series and author of The Shadow on the Path and Father and Son.

Keep My Heart Open in Hell (Nachama Greenwald)

Our willingness to feel the pain of the world is inextricably entwined with our capacity to love. What is the value of keeping our hearts open in hell, when life is most painful and difficult? We all have a deep desire to have our hearts awakened to love. Love can transform us in a powerful way when we are in hell. There is a lot of sorrow in life, but we can choose joy and beauty in the cracks between our sorrows. We can’t keep our hearts open when we are identified, but we are much more than our identifications. In the unitive state with the entirety of creation, we can keep our hearts open in hell. We don’t want to lose our sense of humor, especially in these times when there is so much suffering. Inspiring examples of people who have been able to keep their hearts open in hell are discussed. When we are suffering with the hell of ourselves, aspects of ourselves we are not proud of, how do we stay open with compassion and honesty, without judgment? The capacity to face the truth about ourselves and the world, the way things really are, is essential to the awakening of freedom in life. To love the truth is to love reality, both the heaven and hell realms. To love the truth more than our delusions is the state of a mature adult. How do we go from accepting to loving what is? We learn to love everything by becoming intimately familiar with it. We can walk through hell with our heart open when we are able to love what we do not love. It is possible to be settled in a state of love. Keeping our hearts open in hell is a very high practice that requires a lot of us and is very nuanced, but it is worth discussing if our hearts want to go there. We can work with this by paying attention to the simplest interactions when our hearts are not open. Nachama Greenwald is a physical therapist, editor, and musician who for seventeen years was a member of the Shri blues band which performed Western Baul music.

Waking to Ordinary Life (Lalitha)

As long as we have a body, ordinary life will present things that ego considers problems. Waking to ordinary life implies that we’re not awake. When we are stagnant and fearful, interested in a safe comfort zone, we do not notice the beauty of ordinary life. But we can broaden our view. Waking to ordinary life is about cultivating a vulnerability to beauty. This occurs when we have the necessity to face the difficulties of ordinary life without compromise. If we take a closer look at ordinary life and lean into it, beauty explodes on us. “Every breath for beauty” is a secret for enduring joy. Being overwhelmed by being busy can conceal our fear. We can consider that any space, including the bathroom, can be an empowered chamber that nurtures transformation. The state of a bathroom indicates something about our mental state, the clutter in our thinking. We may not know how clutter pollutes our practice and work. Cleansing our mind can begin with cleaning spaces. We have to notice the piles of clutter before we can declutter. We can’t blame it on others; we have to look in the dark places ourselves. Comedy is a great tool to nourish our brain. It’s normal to think there is no stability in chaos, but there is a view in which chaos is very stable. It’s worth shaking up our dearly held beliefs. Action needs to be taken in ordinary life, and it can be messy. Energy follows the quality, direction, and motives of our attention. We can produce food for influences that live off contention and the disturbance of mind. If we know we are not able to “hold our seat,” it can be healthier to withdraw our attention from influences such as politics so that we are not participating in perpetual disturbance. Lalitha is a spiritual teacher with an ashram in British Columbia, Canada, who was empowered by her master Lee Lozowick in 1998. Her books include Waking to Ordinary Life and Cultivating Spiritual Maturity.

The Art of Japa (Michael Menager and Mic Clarke)

Mantra is likely older than language, sounds that were received by the rishis, poet mystics of the Vedas. It can be silent and internal, a form of thought that reveals more as one goes deeper into it. One meaning of mantra is “crossing over the mind.” How can a sacred sound take us beyond the incessant machinery of mind? Japa is defined as speaking mantra, a simple practice of devotional repetition of a name of God. We sacrifice self-reference and reorient attention to the Divine name. The world becomes magical as we enter into relationship with the sacred. Remembering God’s name is a practice suited to the age of Kali, when the world is in darkness. Ramnam (saying the name of Ram as a Divine expression) is really repeating the name of our own immortal self. Any name of God is equally good. Mantra removes distinction, judgment and separation. Ancient mantras that have come through revelation are empowered. A mantra can be a blessing force that invokes the living presence of a teacher who activated it. We can bring our mind back to a mantra, observing what is going on for us and remembering that help is available. Being present with others in distress and doing japa can create a chamber, a field or space where solutions emerge without trying to change or fix a situation. If we are like a hollow bamboo, the wind can come through us and play its tune. The name and reality of the name are inseparable. Japa is an experiential practice that can be done anywhere, at any time. Kirtan is devotional chanting that can create a field of sound, music, and heartfulness. Michael Menager is a musician, singer, author, and modern-day troubadour whose third album is titled Line in the Water. Mic Clarke is a writer, practitioner of Vedic astrology, and mental health social worker. Both live in New South Wales, Australia and are students of Lee Lozowick.

Regulating the Nervous System in Spiritual Work (Clelia Vahni Lewis)

We can’t separate our nervous system from the nervous systems of others we are in relationship to since we affect one another. In a practical sense, we are not separate. Nervous systems do not develop in isolation. If we are not regulated and have children, there is an immediate effect on them. Co-regulation is the regulation of emotions and behaviors in relationships or groups. We don’t have the family and tribal traditions that produce co-regulation today. Group protocols can help groups self-regulate as an organism. We may think spiritual practices or understanding will do the psychological or physiological work that is necessary and then find we need to address it. Spiritual practices are potentially nervous system regulating, which is not the aim of practices but one aspect of them that can support our spiritual journey. Psychological work is not the same as spiritual work. The point of spiritual work is to allow for consciousness in the body to disidentify and come into relationship with a much larger Reality. For that to take place without the organism going into panic, we need a grounded sense of self. A healthy ego is necessary in order to transcend it. We don’t need to beat ourselves up for not having regulated nervous systems. The idea is not to stop reacting but to maintain continuity of presence and awareness. It’s beneficial to relax. Without encountering and engaging a level of energetic intensity, we may not get to the wakefulness that allows for transformation. A well-regulated nervous system can move flexibly between different states and experiences and be in relationship with the unknown. Breath can be an indicator of whether we’re regulated or not and is also a pathway toward regulation. Clelia Vahni Lewis is the author of Stainless Heart: The Wisdom of Remorse and a freelance editor specializing in works of dharma, spiritual practice, self-help, and memoir.

The Only Grace Is Loving God (Mary Angelon Young)

The book, The Only Grace Is Loving God, written in twilight language or ecstatic speech by Lee Lozowick in 1982, was inspired by Answer to Job, CG Jung’s discussion of the human struggle with an image we have of God and the suffering we experience. The Divine image has to include the feminine aspect of existence in order for Christ consciousness, a God of love and mercy, to be born in us. Conscious participation in our individuation is needed for the image that we have of God to grow. Lee refers to God and the Great Process of Divine Evolution as one and the same in his writings. The truth of existence is nondual reality; there is only God. Realizing the masculine polarity of being, fulfillment of the Law or surrender to the Will of God, is divine destiny and the same for everyone in all forms. The only gateway to God is the feminine, which is not about gender but qualities of being that exist in each of us. Realizing the perfection of the feminine is different for every form of existence. Loving God is not a destiny but the ultimate human possibility, a gift of Grace which cannot be earned. To love God is whimsical, illogical, wild, spontaneous, unpredictable, paradoxical, useless and foolish. The only hope for the world is for individuals to stay in the heartbreak and take responsibility for inner work that has to be done. We have to find our own way and revelation. Trusting in the benevolence of the universe and imagination are key. Wisdom communicates through presence. The Great Process just keeps going; there is no top end. We can live into the consideration of loving God. Mary Angelon Young is a workshop leader with a background in Jungian psychology, an editor and author of As It Is, Under the Punnai Tree, The Baul Tradition, Caught in the Beloved’s Petticoats, Enlightened Duality (with Lee Lozowick), The Art of Contemplation, and other books.